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A woman in an unhappy marriage gets divorced and is celibate for 10 years while building her business. She then puts an ad on Craigslist looking for a cuckold and found her new husband. He is a successful businessman; "Alpha male" in the boardroom, cuck husband in the bedroom. She talks about how she came to understand this was the type of relationship she wanted and needed.
Crystal Welch is a blogger, speaker, and podcaster on ethical non-monogamy. You can find her at CrystalWelch.com
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EP 75 I Found a Cuck Husband Online.
Okay, so 10 years, not one date,
not a single one.
So I'm assuming no sets.
Yes, that's very true.
Really, you were celibate for 10 years.
I'm a busy professional. I'd like to have an occasional companion and the right kind of man for me would be a cuckold male.
Oh, you put out an ad for a cuck.
I did. The truth about women's sexuality is the more sex we have, the more we want. Yeah. And the more we don't have, the more we don't want.
He left an instruction before he arrived, he wanted my husband to bring him his drink, dropped to his knee and suck his dick as an establishment of who's in charge here. He will give oral sex he will clean up after he he'll fluff you he does all of that. It's not out of an urge to touch another man. It is pure power exchange for him.
So let's get to it.
(Podcast Show Open)
Welcome to 2022. Everyone. Happy New Year everyone. Let's make it a great year. I want you to love more play more. And in the case of Cameron Heston from Washington State, shave more. He's the winner of our Manscaped give away so the performance package 4.0 is headed to Washington and Cameron Heston, congratulations! Be sure to check out consentingadultshow.com read the advice column, read a confession, maybe leave a confession. And if you're enjoying this content please go over to BUYMEACOFFEE.COM/LeynaNguyen and become a member! Show us some love that's buymeacoffee.com/leynanguyen.
My guest today is 59 year old Crystal Welch, who after 25 years of success in wealth management, because of what was happening in her personal life. What's happening now in her professional life has to do with the lifestyle. And like so many of my other guests. She grew up in a very traditional family. She was married, probably not happily. And then she got divorced. And after being single for 10 years, she found the lifestyle. And she found her new husband in the lifestyle love the story of how she found him. So Crystal, thanks for being on here and sharing your story. You were married? I'm assuming it was like traditional monogamous marriage. Very, you don't sound too happy about that?
Well, it's it's a good question. And it's a good place to start. Because I was raised in a very traditional conservative family on a farm. I never thought any other idea than to just get married with a white picket fence and have kids and be married till you're dead. Those are the values I went into it with. But what I found after a number of years, we were married a total of 15 years, we just ended up living separate lives, absolutely separate lives. I felt like I was a single parent. I felt like I had all the restrictions and obligation of traditional monogamous marriage and none of the benefits. So it changed
Well, what would have been a benefit? Like regular sex.
Yeah, like regular sex like a companion like socializing with him like a companion, a friend, a lover, right and engaged partner, somebody that was actually interested in me and what we were doing in life and we just be just completely disconnected. And I won't put all that on him. It was me too. But I found my disappointment in marriage itself. Very, it was that was the saddest part because I expected it to be happy forever.
Sure, so many people too. Sure. Okay, so you get divorced, and you spent 10 years single, which on paper was like, wow, what, but I know that, especially as a career woman, you know, you're building up a business, you're busy. The time actually goes by really fast when you're having any relationships.
No, the truth is, I didn't I didn't have a single date. I couldn't I what I went broke after my divorce. That's the truth. And I've been an entrepreneur all of my life. And it just requires that you really, you've got to put everything you have to it. I didn't have any interest or any bandwidth left for any kind of relationship. They all went into rebuilding my business and a new career. So
Okay, so 10 years, not one date, not a single one. So I'm assuming no sex?
Yes, that's very true.
Really, you were celibate for 10 years?
I was I was in fact, and I'm deeply sexual.
So hold on. What did you do?
Well, you know,
You are invested in battery power. Right,
exactly. Yeah, there's certain amount of that. But yeah, I think I heard a comment from somebody yesterday that said, the truth about women's sexuality is the more sex we have, the more we want. Yeah. And the more we don't have, the more we don't want. I agree. And so past a certain point, you know, when you're focused on building a business and doing other things, it's not on the radar screen. And that's how it works. I mean, I didn't set out to do that, right, just that I just only had energy for so much. And it didn't include that.
It becomes like not a priority. You know, it's like down there at the bottom of your list of 100 priorities. So I get it. Yeah. So after 10 years goes by, you meet with success, you're doing well, at one point, you'll probably realize, Hey, you, it would be kind of cool to have a partner in life, right?
That's exactly what happened. And I started looking around saying, now I've rebuilt everything I've got, you know, my business is booming, My, you know, I've got the house I want everything's working. Now, I would really like to see if it's even possible this lifetime to have a companion. I didn't want to get married again. I never thought I would marry again, because I thought marriage was synonymous with monogamy. And so I staked a claim for what I wanted, right then I hope your listeners will probably laugh at me or the ones that remember but I put a little two line ad on Craigslist years ago saying I'm a busy professional. I'd like to have an occasional companion and the right kind of man for me would be a cuckold male.
Oh, you put out an ad for a cuck?
I did. I was
Hold on because like, even now it's still so taboo to talk about. But you know, 10 years ago or however long ago is yeah, it was it was eight years ago, eight years ago. Okay, so did you get responses? Mm hmm. Yeah.
Interesting thing about Craigslist, you could put any old thing up there, and you get 400 responses from men, but I'd leave it up only like 15-20 minutes. So that's how short the window was, like one of those responders was my current husband. And we just hit it off. And so our dynamic agreement, at least in this basic form was set from day one. And I think that's what makes my story a little bit different. Because typically, this dynamic is more driven by men, I was never going to be trapped by some man's idea of what marriage and Monogamy was, so they could check out or they could lose their erection, or they could find a cutie down the street, and I would be stuck with obligations of marriage. And I just wasn't ever going to do that again.
Okay, I've got a lot of questions. First of all, did you know what a cuck was? I mean, you really hadn't had any experience of the lifestyle. So how did you know what to advertise for?
Well, you're digging out all my secrets now. So in the years that I was single, I would play in the femme dom dynamic. You know, I'm a strong assertive woman, and that comes very naturally to me. And the demand is so high for it. It's non sexual. It's just you know, I would go out with guys and torture them because that's what they wanted to hold, spank them or tie him up or something. And I had fun with that dynamic, but it was, you know, it's a non sexual it's, it's a power exchange dynamic. So yeah, so I was familiar with a cuckold term, and I thought, if I'm going to do this at all, he's going to have to be monogamous with me. And of course, I never will be again. So that's, that's how it's gonna go.
Okay, so here's another question I have. You mentioned that this kind of lifestyle is driven mostly by men, which I think like the vanilla public would be like, what? Right like it doesn't compute. They think cuck they think someone who has completely no control?
Oh, that's so not true. That's one of the biggest myths of all, I don't know the actual statistics of the percentage, I would guess just based on my own experience, I bet it's 100 or 500 to one. There's so many more men. And I think a lot of that when I think about the reasons for it. I think much of that comes because men watch more porn, typically. And you can see the statistics, I think cuckolding is now the number one most searched porn topic. And that's men that are searching for it, not women so much. There's just so many more men who want to be cuckolds than there are women who are willing to play that role.
It still amazes me because everyone I talked to kind of explains the same thing. It just doesn't make sense. So describe your husband to me.
Well, he is a very typical guy. He's highly successful. He's a director level at a billion dollar company. So he's not, you know, I would laugh when you're in I heard your other interview that people had conception that you know, Swingers or old fat hippies. That's not us. Right? And, and for a lot of the same reasons we really delved into his mindset early on, because he's a very, very driven, successful business person, but being cuz he carries so much responsibility during the day, there's a part of him that craves just letting go of all of that power and letting somebody else be in charge for a while. I mean, he craves it. It's the thing that creates vacation in his mind, and it frees him up so that he can go back out into his career and do what he does there. But in his personal life, he is very, very, he can be very submissive and very, very much a cuck.
I completely get that because I think people who are insecure, don't want to be the cuck. It's the people who are always in control, very confident, who in the bedroom, like, you know, that is what turns them on. It's something that they don't get in their everyday life. Okay, so this guy answers your ad. Why did you choose him?
Even to this day, in terms of picking bulls and stuff like that? My biggest criteria is how do I feel when I'm with this person? Are they an easy conversationalist? Are the open? Are they authentic? Are they genuine? Do they have a sense of humor, all those things will determine how I actually feel when I'm with somebody and we just clicked is really bright. You know, I tend to be drawn to people that have big brains, and we just had the best, most engaging conversation. And then he called me up after our little cocktail date for dinner. We went out the next night, and we basically been together ever since. Wow,
Okay. Would you put out an ad for a cuck? And then you meet one? Are your sexual interactions like cuck right away? Or I'm gonna say do you have like normal people sex first and then dive into this other stuff?
Well, the short answer is yes. I hope to demystify it somewhat meeting somebody that you choose in the lifestyle. I think the process for it really isn't any different than if you were single looking for a mate or a husband or a partner with criteria is basically the same. So yeah, we started where we started, but here's the difference. We just dated. And we were, you know, hot for each other. And we were together as much as we could be and all of that stuff in the beginning. And then as we could find acceptable lovers. We started with having an occasional threesomes and that was fun, but nobody that we really wanted to cozy up with on any kind of long term basis. And it evolved, it evolved more into the we've evolved from doing more like swinging through some kind of thing. Now we're looking for I want a primary partner in a bull. That's obviously always going to be second to my husband, but the Bloom has come off the rose for me in terms of a lot of anonymous sex. I think it's COVID isolation and a lot of things has changed the way that I'm thinking but yeah, we started like any other couple does, we just did a couple things and we'd have an occasional threesome and it's continued to evolve every year since then.
Okay, but then wouldn't when does the cuckold stuff take place? So
all of this has to be thoroughly thoroughly discussed with your prospective lover because obviously, one of the main things that comes up in a cuck dynamic is if the bull is 100% terrified that there might be some male touching of any type. You know, they typically make that clear right in the beginning, or if they're okay with it many times they'll make that clear right in the beginning. So the partners that we typically will like to engage with are open really communicative about their wishes and their boundaries. We talk about a lot of stuff before we ever engage just because we don't want to disaster and we know what works for us but it takes a little bit longer to know what that third person's with their you know, with their hot button is going to be what they really want and what they're really opposed to.
Okay, so you said that you get together like any other couple you know, you're like a traditional couple and then you start exploring the lifestyle. You started swinging but when is the the actual cuckolding activity? When does that stuff start? Did it start pretty much at the beginning?
It did it but and again, it was 100% dependent on the bull. One of the things that trips my husband's trigger is he is very, very much into erotic humiliation and that was scary to me in the beginning because like most other women in our culture were indoctrinated from pre birth that you never hurt anyone's feelings you never bully you never humiliate and it had a very very negative connotation to it but so what I did when I realized he had that need I took a class and it helped to put everything in perspective Little education goes along We're trying to understand Why people are driven tend to do some of these things but they were they're needing from it what they get out of it So that's where I started in one I understood that that it wasn't about trying to make him feel Bad it's a What erotic humiliation really is Is it is a way to rewrite Sexual shame so issues that somebody might have sexual shame Over like maybe some bisexual touching or being submissive to an other man those things are all in realm of erotic humiliation especially for a strong man like my husband He has to subjugate himself In favor of a stronger bull. That Is the stuff of erotic humiliation it transmutes sexual shame into eroticism
Okay Now for our simpletons Crystal, give me an example of what you're talking about
Okay well just this last week we had my favorite bull In and he left an instruction before arrived he wanted my husband to Bring him his drink dropp to his knee and suck his dick as an establishment of who's in charge here In our in our in our Our way and he loves that he loves And he ordered him around on All Day Yet it was and it was it was fun for All three of us
Okay So from what I've heard from other guests have been on the show Like the small Penis humiliation thing So is that just like a part of it
Yes It's it can be physical humiliation can be verbally A lot of verbal humiliation you All right small small dick white guy and you know she's finally going to get a chance to be with a real man you know it's a shame that she has stuck with this pathetic little white guy it You know that sounds terrible to people that are They don't understand what erotic humiliation really is but it's It just lights my husband up he just loves it after we have some kind I've scene like that he feels like he's been on a month vacation That's exactly what it does for him
Okay Has this change I'm an obviously you know when you spend time with some One the more time you spend with someone The more your relationship changes and evolves How has your marriage evolved from this?
Oh boy that's great question You know I thought So many different ways to express it but we Are 100 times more intimate, more tender with each other we know each other at such a deep level actually living this Dynamic forces you to communicate on level that I would have never even approached In any kind of Have a vanilla relationship it causes us to talk about things like well what happens if I get really emotionally involved with the bull How are you how's that gonna make You feel what will that do to the You know the structure of our relationship How do you feel When he humiliates you It just forces you To communicate on such a deep level that it creates an intimacy that is almost not describable For me, I wish I could find a good way to describe it. But his loyalty to me and his worship of me because I'm helping him be who he is. I think that's, that's the best way I can say it. I I accept him and encourage him to be who he is and to play out all the things that give him pleasure and release too. And of course, I get all the benefits, too.
Has he been in a cuck relationship before you?
Not specifically, he and his ex wife were actually swingers. But what he noticed he would he would take her she would go to swinger events, and she'd be doing a 10 guy gang bang, what he enjoyed the most is watching her. He very rarely participated in anything. So I think he's probably been hardwired to cuck most of his life. He just didn't recognize it as such, until we really started playing specifically with that dynamic.
Is he bi?
He is not. So that's a good question, too. And I'm glad that you asked it because that's that's a question of a lot of with a lot of misunderstanding, he will give oral sex, he will clean up after he he'll fluff ya, he does all of that. It's not out of an urge to touch another man, it is pure power exchange for him. In other words, he would never ever consider kissing a guy or going to a bar and picking up a guy or anything like that. It's nowhere in his makeup. But in a power exchange dynamic when he's visually verbally physically giving all of his power over to a stronger male, he will do that. And it's a it's an act of humiliation for him and an act of of surrender.
So he will do it in service to you and your bull. Absolutely. Right. Is there anything that you haven't done that you're looking forward to? I mean, do you guys have any fantasies? Or is this just something that's enough? And each time is so different? That it drives you each time?
That's that's an interesting question, too. One of the ways I think I just mentioned a while ago that I have changed myself is that I'm not a volume girl. I don't want 10 bulls. It's not interesting to me. And frankly, I can't find 10 people that I'm attracted to, very honestly. But I feel like I want more connection. Now since I've been very isolated with COVID, like many people have been, I feel like I want more connection, I want more friendship, I want more of a relationship relationship, and not just sexual experience. So that's a change in me. Now the trick with that is finding that that's probably my our biggest challenge in playing this dynamic out the difficulty in finding acceptable partners. And they're very discriminating and and wanting more of a connection that rules out a lot of men that want to be swingers in just one experience,
Right? And does the fact that you want more of a connection, is that acceptable in your marriage? I mean, is it okay with your husband that you're searching for a connection with someone?
It is and that's one of the things that we grew into, because in the very beginning, we had a hard line in the sand. We'll do this but we can have no emotional involvement at all. We don't want that we don't want anything to tamper with the quality of our relationship. However, as we went on and we met a really special person lives in another state, and we began talking with him and then pretty soon we're talking with him every day. Pretty soon we fly out to see him and then he flies up to see us and we got very, very, very involved and I mean, falling in love involved home and the two guys were just great friends with each other. He and I were just crazy about each other and we got involved in so it's so pushed us it gave us two things It pushed us into more of a poly dynamic where we thought that this is really what we want we want A deep relationship with one person not surface relationship with 100.
The second thing it did for us is it was a clear demonstration of compersion. For those of you who aren't familiar with that term compersion is the opposite of jealousy. It's when you're genuinely happy that your partner is receiving pleasure or being happy, being happy for that not being hurt from that. So he demonstrated that he has that capability. And so it changed our it changed our calculation, when we knew that we could step that far into it, and it wouldn't blow up our relationship. That was a whole, that's a whole new world for us now. So we accept the fact that human beings have capacity to love more than one person.
So you found something that brings you a lot of joy. But what else did it do? Because now you also tried to help others.
Yes, and that's I spent most of my working career as a wealth manager in the divorce arena. So I'm very, very over just like you're over inundated with murder and mayhem. I'm over inundated with divorce in and acrimony and people going broke and all of that stuff. But what I really found is that I lost interest. I just, I've just been doing it for so long. And you know, when you're burned out on something, you just can't put your heart to it anymore. But I felt like I wanted meaning and purpose. And it took a long time for this to gel up, I thought, well, maybe there's somebody that I could help if we could be a bridge to people who want to not cheat, hurt their partners or get divorced. But they want to find a way to reconcile these two core needs, you know, the core need for safety and security versus the need for change and excitement. We all have both of those needs. And I think the intersection of how people resolve that will determine if you can find a positive and healthy way to resolve those two needs. Because if you may not be feeling both of them now, but at some point you will, if I can prevent one divorce or one affair by helping people find another way by learning how to communicate deeper by acknowledging the fact that they have a need for adventure as well as their need for safety. That's a mission that I can get behind so that that's that is my whole purpose now.
Leyna: If you'd like to connect with her at crystalwelch.com. And after talking to Crystal I felt I needed to get the other side of the story. I talked to Crystal's cuck husband. And that interview is coming up for Cuck week which starts January 25. Next week on Consenting Adults--someone's who's been living a secret life and has told no one about it, until now.
Guest: In case I see someone I know, or I need to get out of a situation quickly, there's still that man part of me that it doesn't let me completely go to my woman persona.
That's next time, on Consenting Adults.
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